9 do not the sailors of the ships fear the sea? yet you sinners do not fear the most high ... enoch

will be inward on the climb ... much work in reaching the waterfall

peace and love

eurthypro dilemma --plato

In philosophical theism[edit]

The dilemma can be modified to apply to philosophical theism, where it is still the object of theological and philosophical discussion, largely within the Christian, Jewish, and Islamic traditions. As German philosopher and mathematician Gottfried Leibniz presented this version of the dilemma: "It is generally agreed that whatever God wills is good and just. But there remains the question whether it is good and just because God wills it or whether God wills it because it is good and just; in other words, whether justice and goodness are arbitrary or whether they belong to the necessary and eternal truths about the nature of things."[1] wikipedia

Q: is it good and just because God wills it or whether God wills it is good and just? 

answer: neither ... because God is not arbitrary  ... according to man's vices. one cannot compare the mind of man to the mind of God. there is no equivalent to {this}, or to measure within this (recall the Angel instructs John
where to measure?), because man's mind is not God's. man does not know what he does not know and ... so, too, with God ... he knows you or 'He' doesn't know you. God knows you through WHAT IS GOD, or what is of honest measure (truth). so, where is mankind's Prophet on Truth that he might UNDERSTAND what is God?

so, how well do you know and love self that you are able to love neighbor within Love?

for any institution, doctrine, man or ... in its state, claiming itself and setting itself up as Authority on God, God's Mouthpiece, absolute knowledge on Gd, knowing God's mind-thoughts ... infallible in its teaching on God ... is blasphemy. it is beyond clarity, riotous ... indecent, OFF THE MARK ... and because its taste is an abomination, it is vomited out---spit out from the mouth of the Lord. It is beneath God ... a seed not grown into a plant producing fruit ... possibly a moldy seed or root ... tasteless---foul tasting. 

as enoch shares ... a sailor not fearing the sea is an ignorant sailor ... an arrogant sailor ... a sailor not worthy of the sea. the sea will spew him out. but why does the sailor fear the sea? he is not so afraid that he is unwilling to enter the waters, but he understands that it is in constant motion. he is not sitting in a warm bathtub playing with his yellow duckies ... he is bridled to 'something' he cannot see ... cannot hear and must be of an awareness not just for his own safety but the safety of his crew. weather ... wind, rain, rogue waves that seem to come out of nowhere ... strong currents ... and the strength and make of his ship is what? 

God is not manifest in creeds and ritualistic hottubs, or even cold tubs. no man has SPIRITUAL power to do anything without what? there is not one wise man among you ... why is that?

because I am engaging in BC the Trilogy ... Book One: Before Christ ... having returned to continue in dialogue within this ... I'm not able to put time into sharing on OWA or SPIR as I once did. but to make a long story short ... a bunch of men sitting in excess debating "the fate" of others is not only irreverent but it's IRRELEVANT ... it is irrelevant in this Day. these men are as stagnant as stagnant can be ... as they cannot know the mind of God from where they sit in their male dominion of religious sequestering. God Almighty, why anyone in this Day would believe these guys have any worth in the VOICE of TRUTH is  ... well, sad ... truly sad. they can certainly say and do as they please ... these men of title and riches ...  if their government permits them this freedom ... and pretend at authorship of God, even spending enormous amounts of money to house and feed these day after day while others are suffering, even starving ... some divorced for reasons of sanity and fighting to stay alive ... some sexually abused and ... some as young as five, six ... seven ... eight nine and ten years old during this ... some beaten ... bleeding ... ostracized ... denied ... used as sex slaves ... used to sell sex online and ... these men sit and debate as silly, erroneous spectacle, claiming to know what is right or wrong for those not even remotely like them ... FEMALE BEING ONE ... MARRIED MEN AND WOMEN WITH REAL JOBS AND REAL CHILDREN ... not rubber duckies in warm bathtubs ... although we are quite certain that there are many, many children and women and men that would love a warm bath but have not the house of the money for such a luxury. how are your baths, you men of the contrite heart? yes, from this day forward ... that will be how you are known:

MEN OF THE CONTRITE HEART ... as you are broken and no use to us in this Day. 

so, later alligator ... don't let the stench of your self-indulgance wilt your false halos ... you pious fornicators bleeding the people dry



or maybe it is just getting started ... you know, learning the ropes

ADDED: http://news.yahoo.com/uk-ebola-relapse-case-takes-virus-specialists-uncharted-150150416.html


 and regarding Matthew 19. 7 and

look at genesis 3. 10. 

no one enters the kingdom [of heaven] naked-----Gnostic Literature
nakedness is man kind ... undeserving of the sea or the ship or the crew for the stream of Prophetic Wisdom (Truth---walking with the Angels of God). man must move out of the mind of man to REALIZE his true mentor and Guardian. if he is of catholic mindset and/or those like it, he is universally kept within the doctrines of man---ordained within elementary ... wardenship. GOD IS NOT UNIVERSAL OF MIND. SPIRIT IS CALLED WITHIN THE FORM OF ONE: God ... Love. Universal is bound by man's decrees---its knowledge and understanding, which is as nekked as a newborn hairless squirrel squealing for mother's milk, and warmth. divorce yourself from this and you divorce yourself from the FORM of SPIRITUAL WELLBEING ... its company, companionship and impartial deeds. you are at the mercy of lusts, and those naughty, loveless pirates determined to steal ...................................



what will you and bernie do about these cases and all the other "crazy" messed up murders coming, jorge?


she was very protective of her children then suddenly just snapped? huh ... how horrible ... what gift did you leave in NY, jorge? or should we be asking what gift did you take? 3 in one month ... how terrible---how sad.

a religious white guy with no wife and no kids ... who thinks that only MEN can be priests and only MEN are called by God to this uppity higher place of "godliness" ... silenced her with his big head and big -big- big you know grabbing the spotlight hey look at me everybody look at the pope and the roman catholic church and you know ... male dominion! and poor mom of several kids got silenced by big white man with big institution and big words which mean very little to her STOLE HER TIME AND HER PLACE ... he stole her ... sanity? her worth? her ....

so, who/what let him in to steal their thunder? who/what is setting up RELIGIONs that demean and deny HER WORTH---HER RIGHTFUL PLACE IN THE HOUSES of_____________________________________________
who spent big bucks on this show? a show that stole her thunder? that parades himself in the seats of discrimination and  ... ? what religious denomination and governmental institution held hands and paraded down the aisle for all to see in the big expensive wedding? church and state? rome and the US of A? 

don't believe me? watch what comes

maybe mark silk at rns will write an article about it, blaming the republicans ... 


I read a comment by a man who goes by the name Atheist Max. He wrote something  ... Jesus hates everyone ....? This man is like the synod sitters. From his perch he tries to reach REAL people ... Real people with real children ... within his cult of MISUSING what he does not understand. ask yourself what mind condemns an innocent being because he cannot read the writings. it's like watching the synod in that expensive hotel deciding who lives and who dies. 
a foreigner enters a town and speaks in another language and A-max intentionally tells everyone in town that the man has come to breed hate and confusion ... and has plans to take over the world through DOCTRINE that teaches manipulation, deception, torture and murder ... its doctrine demanding obedience and will use any method necessary to gain control (in any age). you will know them by their fruits. A-max was 47 yrs in roman catholicism ... it taught him all he knows. it matters not which washtub you sit in for ages ... the water smells the same.

who/what CRUCIFIED and CRUCIFIES THE CHRIST? if you can understand this you might just be getting somewhere ... the Evolution of God and Man. with all the horrors in just the US alone, can A-max blame Jesus for all of these? he does not know Jesus, has never met Jesus, does not understand THE LANGUAGE of Jesus and willfully and ignorantly, as well as ABUSIVELY ... MANIPULATIVELY ... uses a few clipped passages from the Writings to slander and disparage "something" he does not understand ... much like the strips cut and used to LASH Jesus in the story ... much like the lashing man (and woman) has given those he did not understand ... all throughout history. A-max, like the synod sitters are pharisees and scribes writing to suit their agendas ... add a twist of militant and you have A-max attempting to recruit for said agenda. ironic that A-max behaves the image in the mirror ... it was how he was raised: DENY, ABUSE AND MISUSE. did 47 yrs praying the rosary to an empty heart teach him to wield a knife like a jedi knight while only two? he contradicts himself endlessly on the comment boards and to see such disgraceful misuse of Being is quite dangerous. do you not see how this is?
ah, maybe it is time you see how this is ...

here is one of the posts ... in case you are unclear on what it is that we speak

Good Christianity…

“Hate your parents…hate your life”(Luke 14:26)

so, maybe rns does not understand the message ... seems we may need to try another way

*oh, and please take note that rns is selective about who/what they serve ... deleting messages, but certainly not deleting atheist max and his dishonest hate rants  ... and writers are notorious for NOT answering commenters questions ... how lame is that? how unethical ... gee, we wonder WHO/WHAT pays them to be so ... partial?

hmm ... 

For even when we were with you, this we commanded you: that if any would not work, neither should he eat. Thess.

doesn't anyone find it curious that rns  ... in all their ads for the current roman pontiff they NEVER once mentioned :

and they NEVER once posted anything on:


and others articles relating to this current pope of the roman catholic church where his slipshod rhetoric and ACTIONS seems not in accord with the PR ....
who favors the institution and the hierarchy and titles, even its politics over the lives of vulnerable women and children? ask yourselves if these have a CONSCIENCE ... 

Lord says: Depart from me you of lawlessness ... I NEVER KNEW YOU. 

I mean, people are asking: who donates money to RNS and who supports this organization ... who is paying the writers to be selective and uninformative, esp in these critical areas. ... and questions on the integrity of RNS and yes, people have said they think it a waste of time and not honest and ... but esp the question on whether or not RNS is somehow in league with the CLERGY/STAFF CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE COVER UP, that they should hide and deny critical info about this current roman pontiff and even some of the more recent vagaries and vagueness regarding him ... 

  1. it has been unquestionably clear, however,  RNS was a party to selective reporting and looks very much like it has dishonesty painted all over it. think now, folks ... we tried to warn them ... but should some really horrid stuff come out about these abuses---the bishops and priests and maybe even the popes ... who have admitted COVERING UP THESE TERRIBLE CRIMES , even with the evidence already having surfaced ... and silencing the poor victims ... in the most indecent and inhuman ways ...  what will these RNS writers look like to the world? do you think they will ever get a job writing again?
  2. you know, it is often the case that an individual is asked to put his best foot forward---the more honest and accurate---even if it goes against the norm, as the numbness and mediocrity and insensitivity, lies, deception and corrupt management  ... and loud noise takes away from the more important ... and individual is asked to speak up in ways he has not done before that he be counted among the living---the truthful and the worthy ... but should he sell himself into lethargy and illicit practices and support that which is harmful and dishonest ... he may ... lose all. 
and the question remains: can you even trust the journalists to report the truth

it all depends on WHO/WHAT is paying them for who-what ...

added: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/13/opinion/the-republicans-incompetence-caucus.html?_r=0

We like how David expresses his views, and allow us to remind you that these are his views. He speaks about temperature and explains his views in a way that we appreciate, because SPIRITUAL EXEGESIS is measured not in manmade credential and not in manmade title or hierarchal deliverance (repentance), but in cosmic allegory, and temperature (heat, light ... hot, cold ... darkness ... warm, tepid, weak ... heavy ... ), however, where we differ in thought is ... in his determination to believe GOVERNMENT is the salve to solving the public disorder and imbalance. It is not. Government is wrought with opinion and opinion IS religious: it is dependent on systems of beliefs and practices and ... is romulan by nature (yes, gene roddenberry read gnostic lit ---I am told --- ;) . 

In order to change OPINION, one must understand the need for change of heart and change of heart can only come through Spiritual Exegesis. There is a reason for what he describes about the republican behavior ... yes, a reason ... he does not see it as he was brought up in the cult of ecumenicism that decides change through dogmatic stream---yes, the same hierarchal stream he criticizes, and yet pats on the back. WE understand his portent and his reasoning on the slow trudge ... but if the tsunami---which he cannot see---is heading straight for him ... is saying REVOLVE and get the hell out of there OR ... REMOVE THAT DEAD BRANCH BECAUSE IT IS HANGING PRECARIOUSLY OVER THOSE THAT PLAY IN THAT AREA ... OR put a ban on that swimming pool because the water is rancid ... filled with [things you do not want to see] ... well, you better act in a REVOLUTIONARY FASHION ... but in a composed paradox ... which requires a means of release AND a partner to assist in that change. it is not reform that is needed ... not in speaking on matters of God ... God is of separate entity, not a respecter of manic formulas enslaved to the hierarchy. the hierarchy is dishonest and placing people in precarious positions and Conscience is bleeding by the truckloads a lot of  ... confusion and turmoil as well as crying out for 'something' revolutionary ...

but, you see REVOLUTIONARY in gnostic Vision is not as man thinks ... it requires Spiritual Exegesis to build the Community (Church founded on Truth). people find it near heretical to say that the two governing parties are caught in a web together and bleeding the people dry (which includes their god belief systems and practices).

I simplify here because I haven't the time to write it all out and I couldn't even if I did because it BECOMES ... as people desire to move ... out of set thinking and ... 

Begin to introduce the WRITINGS in a manner more SPIRITUALLY SYMBOLIC ---the Language these were intent ON --- and you will find the courtship much less torrid, however ... be prepared for the vagrancies of gift. once people begin to see not only THE VALUE OF STUDY WITHIN VERSE APART FROM THE DOGMATIC ... and not theological jibber jabber based on the many opinions of man seated in his creeds OR new age rah-rah, but actual INTERVENTION OF SPIRITUAL WISDOM PERMITTED ... through GNOSIS ... the arts within this cortex ... seeing not only the value, but also the viable ... it will be like bees and honey ... and, for some, the hummingbird to the nectar of the flower.


I see dawkins is in the news again. We have been waiting for this. I recall about 1 1/2 yrs ago telling a catholic priest: keep your eye on richard dawkins ... or something like: watch what happens with richard dawkins. what I am shown is that he will become.

allow me to share something that has not been shared by me ... having to do with the beginning of man. it has to do with his "identity", but the truth is ... HE IS NOT READY TO HEAR IT. this is true! he is not ready to hear it, and there are just a few truly humble enough and open enough to accept the truth about man should they be told. "ah, yes ... I can see this" is what these would say, and this would be the "soldiers" of the Philokalia (farmer, athlete, soldier). you will know them by their fruit is terribly misunderstood in the mechanics of the male ego. we say it in justice, because it is through this that God is realized enough to understand the 'paperwork' that makes up man and his dominion. read it---see it for yourselves! in gnostic literature (texts) Jesus says: Hate hypocrisy. Unlike what the likes of Atheist Max saying: Hate your parents hate your life. 
What A-max says is a bold faced lie ... a twisting of the truth, a twisting of FACTS ... should anyone be brave enough to say it. is anyone brave enough to go there? Jesus does not hate parents or life. Jesus brought truth to the tables of mankind and he rejected it for his own creeds and corridors. no, man is not ready to hear this. Jesus GAVE HIS LIFE AS MUST WE ALL IF WE WISH TO KNOW AND UNDERSTAND AS "I AM", but in gnostic lit, Jesus also says: 
Do better than me.  Imagine that? Do better? why, yes ... as you are being given more if you have not buried what is being given.

gave his life ... hmm ... become martyr? not as man esp dogmatic-creed loving man thinks ... * GOD IS NOT UNIVERSAL OF MIND. SPIRIT IS CALLED WITHIN THE FORM OF ONE: God ... Love. Universal is bound by man's decrees---its knowledge and understanding, which is as nekked as a newborn hairless squirrel squealing for mother's milk, and warmth. divorce yourself from this and you divorce yourself from the FORM of SPIRITUAL WELLBEING ... its company, companionship and impartial deeds. you are at the mercy of lusts, and those naughty, loveless pirates determined to steal ...................................

it is like finding the right time to tell your child he is adopted ... love and concern that he be prepared to hear the news. this is not hate---this is wise. watching and waiting ... sending down (he drew a third of the stars and sent them to the earth) what is needed to assist man in that evolving. man thinks too highly of himself and is why the world is in imbalance* ....... the haves and the have nots ... and only when man is WILLING to be RESPONSIBLE for his acts/actions will he be given the news about himself ... about life ... about God ... THE TRUTH.

why not now? because he MISUSES for his own selfish agendas. he is too young to know the truth and big headed archaic institutions claiming itself God's mouthpiece and infallible does not help MOVE man to where he needs to be to HEAR the truth---to be in a place of hearing---knowing---understanding. he treads all over the feast and mucks up the edible parts ... he smothers and suffocates and buries underneath his very large footprint those trying to grow ... his arrogance and doctrine ... man's laws are not G-D's

I am young in {this} ... but I have been shown much and every day I say, ____, they would kill me if I shared this ... it would be the mob attacking me or scheming to silence me, or as we already see just in the few things we have shared: slander, degrading ... you are doing the work of satan ... yada-yada .. yada ... same old same old and A-max: you are starting a new religion.  .........huh, all lies, but, you see, how it is. the jew (spiritual understanding) demands a miracle he can 'see' ... but what does he do with what he does see? he murders his own. 

no, man is not ready to hear his port of origin. I recall my dream ... one I shared recently ... walking out of the 'arcade' onto a street of darkness ... and I sensed it riddled with evil ---evil lurking in every house and window and side street, and I said, I must leave this place immediately ... I sense great danger, and I left. a person IN Christ of a certain maturity knows when NOT to share. it is a danger to everything he lives for. as Arkimnel told me: not now, when I asked on the paintings in the catacombs ... for I know what they represent, and She said: do not spoil the soil. IOW, not before its time

yes, there is a WAR going on that man does not see. some do sense it ... but have not the knowledge and understanding on what this is or what it means. there are angels good and evil ... (I) stand between two realms. I have been shown things that man has dreamed about but never understood, but I am young and know not the fullness ... for it would be too much for one so small. you see? so small ... 

if your desire is to call me crazy, go ahead and see what happens for I am beyond the point of man's hatred and depositions. I even listen to what the "mentally ill" say as there is something of importance being released ... (I) work what man rejects as everything has some purpose, and often it is those rejected and misunderstood by society that Spirit may use ... such a mystery---yes? if man in his "correctness" and rightness according to his own theologies and philosophies decides who lives and who dies ... Spirit may just pick the one dying to share. I know already that this is esoteric for most so I cease and go back to BC The Trilogy, Book One: BEFORE CHRIST.